I completely blame my Dad (may he rest in peace) for my interest in the Ivy League (most recently piqued by this New Yorker column on Ivy League percentages in presidential administrations). A classic Korean immigrant, my Dad was obsessed with Harvard. In fact, my parents settled in Belmont (a suburb next to Cambridge) so that all 7 of their kids could live at home and be but a short bus ride to Harvard (unfortunately, he went 0 for 7 on that dream).
I wasn’t a good enough high school student to consider the Ivy’s for college, but by the time I finished my Master’s I was, and was accepted to several schools – including Cornell – for my Ph.D.
But then I was faced with a problem. Should I follow my (or rather, my father’s?) Ivy envy to Cornell, even though I was warned by multiple faculty members and students that my potential advisor was crazy, had an intellectual property lawsuit waged against her (by a former disgruntled graduate student), and that I should be prepared to change advisors (and fields entirely) if I came to Cornell? Was I tempting fate to walk into that situation with those famous suicide gorges nearby? Was it worth suffering 4-6 years of academic torture to attempt to validate my intellect with an Ivy League pedigree?
I ended up heading to Queen’s University in Canada, where the advisor seemed (and ended up being) the perfect fit, the tuition was a pittance, and my Master’s would actually count for something (at Cornell, they would have made me start over again). When I told my Dad about my decision, he hung up the phone on me and didn’t talk to me for 3 weeks. It wasn’t until sometime told him that Queen’s was considered the “Harvard of the North” (disputable, what with McGill and University of Toronto, but whatever…) that he perked up and started talking to me again.
Ivy envy apparently runs deep.
4:30 pm on December 11th, 2008
Good link. I missed that.
You know, I went to Cornell, and the suicide rate isn’t actually that high. It’s a great school overall, but only if the department matches what you want. That’s true of any school. You were so smart to think of the day-to-day dealings with the advisor and opt for a better fit. I love Cornell but I think that any school that is a right fit or you is the best of all, and it shows—that’s why we have people in every field excelling from every school.
I feel for your dad, though. For a long time, ivy was a goal that defined excellence. That definition has changed over the years and it’s so easy now to see a million paths to happiness or success than just that one. When I think of my girl, I wonder what she’ll want to do—and will it involve school at all? As her mom, I need to remain open to that possibility just as much as her wanting to go whole hog academic. My mom wanted me to go to art school and write for SNL and I’m not sure she has ever fully forgiven me.
I really liked some of the comments from the school presidents. I’m rather liking Skorton, I have to say. Common sense, ability, and ivy are not all mutually exclusive.
Ooh, tidbit you might not know: Cornell, in fact, is a land-grant state school, as well as an ivy. So, Cornell students aren’t really one or the other—they’re a unique combo of both.
[Reply]
3:05 pm on December 16th, 2008
Your post hits a chord with me as my GF is currently applying to PHD programs in the US and I’m in the role of supportive partner. There are lots of factors to consider like school/program reputation, location and cost. Having a helpful (not crazy) advisor is also at the top of our list. Luckily this hasn’t been a big factor to date, but it is still early in the process. I think you made the best decision not to endure 4-6 years of academic hell. Not only for your academic health, but I’m sure your support network of friends and family would have been stressed along with you making it a trying time for everyone.
[Reply]
3:15 pm on December 16th, 2008
Jonathan, you make an excellent point that I didn’t mention - going through graduate school isn’t just hard on the person pursuing the degree, but immediately (and sometimes profoundly) impacts the loved ones of the student.
I had many moments even at Queen’s when the stress and trials of the process really got to me and it was not super fun for my friends or my husband.
I wish you and your girlfriend luck in navigating the graduate school waters!
[Reply]